Logs for #trilema

Go to: #trilema #pizarro #trilema-mod6 #chainstate #eulora

2018-5-10 | 2018-5-12

esthlos: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-09#1811661 << thanks, seems to be working now
a111: Logged on 2018-05-09 18:36 hanbot: esthlos : your blog's comments are borkt (commenter sees 'Error: please fill the required fields (name, email).' despite entering fields), see the "edit" here for the fix http://thewhet.net/2017/10/a-compendium-of-possibly-helpful-stuffs-for-erecting-mircea-popescus-wordpress-with-nearly-free-speech-hosting/
ben_vulpes: https://www.military.com/daily-news/2018/05/08/fitzgerald-officer-deck-pleads-guilty-court-martial.html
asciilifeform: 'Lt. j.g. Sarah Coppock's job was to ensure safe navigation of the USS Fitzgerald. On June 17, 2017, she was "derelict in the performance of those duties," resulting in the deaths of seven sailors, according to the single charge she faced Tuesday.' << somebody give this chix order of lenin.
ben_vulpes: heh
asciilifeform: it is very difficult , however, to beat the record of the http://btcbase.org/log/2014-09-07#821351 d00d
a111: Logged on 2014-09-07 04:09 asciilifeform: (who? him: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/navy-nuclear-submarine-burned-arsonist-scrapped-article-1.1421356)
esthlos: trinque asciilifeform phf etc: what's the best way to deal with sbcl's package lock error when redefining run-program? my naive approach was to define a new package for the vtron. But I'm pounding my head against use-package anyway
esthlos: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-08#1811127 << ben_vulpes: can you elaborate on what you envision here? for instance, I could build up and tear down keyring on every press, which seems only way to be stateless with gnupg. how does that sound?
a111: Logged on 2018-05-08 15:34 ben_vulpes: use a tempdir for gnupg's keyring; thing must be stateless.
asciilifeform: esthlos: have you considered reading my original v ?
asciilifeform: generally recommended, for folx writing their own.
esthlos: I have it locally, compared parts of it after writing my implementation
mod6: i agree, read alf's.
esthlos: not to make excuses: makes sense to read it
trinque: esthlos: I don't think anyone demands you use precisely that name, if doing so results in more needless complexity than just picking another.
ben_vulpes: esthlos: yeah, that's what i did and i think asciilifeform as well
ben_vulpes: i think mod6's worked that way eventually too
ben_vulpes bbiab
esthlos: got it
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/h81Ey/?raw=true << final draft for your review. let me know if anything
mircea_popescu: i plan to publish in ~hour.
ben_vulpes: esthlos: i made a gensym dir in /tmp, passed that to gpg for the workdir, and then various operations take a teardown key, defaulting to true which could be overriden to inspect keyring state should the operator so desire
ben_vulpes: vpatch is 300 lines including examples
ben_vulpes quite looking forward to this trilema
mircea_popescu: i;d say is one of the lulziest ever.
ben_vulpes: and also the hn instaban
ben_vulpes: mod6: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/fz5lc/?raw=true
mod6 looks
asciilifeform: oh hey !
asciilifeform reads..
mod6: ben_vulpes: ack
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: fire at will
asciilifeform: loox great.
mircea_popescu: aaand it's out.
asciilifeform: bwahahaha
mircea_popescu: you know it took like 30 woman-hours, this thing ? not even counting my time.
asciilifeform can picture.
asciilifeform originally thought 'such small find, what can even be had from it' but mircea_popescu's olive press worx wonderz.
mircea_popescu: incidentally, and for all time : http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-09#1811668 <<->> http://trilema.com/2018/and-in-things-that-didnt-happen-today-heres-192-cracked-github-keys-some-hotties-in-tech-included-yes/#footnote_4_79316
a111: Logged on 2018-05-09 19:21 asciilifeform: hey mircea_popescu ( or anybody else ) do you happen to have a script handy for mass submission of links to archive.is ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: exactly what i wanted, ty
mircea_popescu: even saves resulting urls.
mod6: nice post mircea_popescu!
mircea_popescu: hm, is the lining messed up ?
asciilifeform: formatting ? looks proper here
mod6: they go cascading from left to right, looks ok but when you get down to 'jgabrielygalan' there is a funny looking wrap where 'key: 1' is left most justified.
mod6: but seems to be pretty good anyway
mod6: (might just be my screen or whatever)
mod6: lmao 'thigh and pelvis arch'
asciilifeform: bahaha fortunately db is o(n log n) nao, since each time mircea_popescu fixes a typo, his wptron loads all 193 keyz...
mircea_popescu: mod6, hit a reload ?
mod6 does
mircea_popescu: i put some clearing elements in.
mod6: oh yah, there you go
mod6: *thumbsup*
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, kik
asciilifeform: i assume it's for the pingback feature
mircea_popescu: it is yes.
asciilifeform: at any rate thing oughta be able to stand up to whatever treatment the upstream pipe can give it, nao.
mircea_popescu: curious which of the luminaries of pantsuit technologees gets pwnd first.
asciilifeform: some of the lusers ( i specifically did not bother with exhaustive survey ) swapped keyz since '16, others -- not
mircea_popescu: prolly should re-do the db walk anyways.
asciilifeform: ( at some point we do a refresh )
asciilifeform: aha
asciilifeform: hey douchebag , pretty good entry level problem for you
asciilifeform: i.e. retrieve all https://github.com/luser.keys , for all known values of luser
asciilifeform brb,food
mircea_popescu: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/factor/6323 fucking lolz.
mod6: :D
deedbot: http://trilema.com/2018/and-in-things-that-didnt-happen-today-heres-192-cracked-github-keys-some-hotties-in-tech-included-yes/ << Trilema - And in things that "didn't happen" today : here's 192 cracked github keys (some hotties in "tech" included, yes).
mod6: exponent 35 lel!
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, here's a suspicious : so many of these tards have known factors like 2, 3, 5 -- showing there was ~no primality test involved. isn't it bizarre we don't see other factors then, say 111 ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, also webnitpick. see eg in https://archive.is/AvNme how the table cuts off the field ? is there some way to flow it instead ?
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: howdja determine "some access to private repos"?
mircea_popescu: i'll have to get back to you on that.
mircea_popescu: (they leak it somewhere, but dun reclal right off where)
ben_vulpes: > especially the varieties you can afford << har har har
ben_vulpes: are ukeleles the instrument for people both too poor for a piano and lazy to learn guitar?
mod6: hahaha
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: adrian popa entry has a random https://archive.is/ string
mod6: Software Engineer at The Nerdery, Minneapolis, MN << leeel
mod6: I love this post.
ben_vulpes: there is, or was i don't really care to look, something named like that in portland too: "The Open Sourcery"
ben_vulpes: 'please never give us money or trust us with anything'
ben_vulpes: solid haul asciilifeform mircea_popescu
mod6: Indeed.
mod6: Phuctor prevails!
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, aty
mircea_popescu: its funny too, wp counts 3k words, but it's like 85kb. LONG WORDS
lobbes: jesus, nice sifting mircea_popescu
lobbes: and great win for phuctor overall
mircea_popescu: :)
lobbes: side note, that mass-submit archiver.is script puts mine to shame. You were able to get around the damn cloudshit with that?
mircea_popescu: sure ?
mircea_popescu: try it, why not.
lobbes: yeah sorry, I'm sleep deprived. I remembered I only need the phantom js shit for the -download- portion, not submit
mircea_popescu: you mean download from archive.is ?
lobbes: yeah
mircea_popescu: no wai ?!
lobbes: oh yeah, I've had the automated downloading thing going for months
mircea_popescu: but i mean... for what part ? plain curl will fetch the page.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812073 << reflows in all of my browsers
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 04:16 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, also webnitpick. see eg in https://archive.is/AvNme how the table cuts off the field ? is there some way to flow it instead ?
mircea_popescu: well... not in archive ?
asciilifeform: incl it
asciilifeform: anybody else see nonreflow ?
mircea_popescu: holy shit check this out.
lobbes: mircea_popescu: curl will get the 'https://archive.is/AvNme,' but the thing I'm running downloads the 'https://archive.is/download/AvNme.zip'
mircea_popescu: lobbes, curl will get any url you point it to neh ? curl 'https://archive.is/download/AvNme.zip' > AvNme.zip
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, http://browsershots.org/http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/factor/6335 << notice, some don't.
mircea_popescu: though at this point ima call it "fix your browser".
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812072 << riemann had sumthing to say re subj iirc
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 04:11 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, here's a suspicious : so many of these tards have known factors like 2, 3, 5 -- showing there was ~no primality test involved. isn't it bizarre we don't see other factors then, say 111 ?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, it seems to me the factors ~aren;t~ normally distributed.
mircea_popescu: ie, not ~exactly~ "picked a random number, tested for no primalities". but biased source.
asciilifeform: possibly
lobbes: mircea_popescu: aye, but try that out for yerself; comes back as 0 bytes
lobbes: hence, needing the hack around the cloudshit
lobbes: crude hack, but worx for now.
mircea_popescu: jesus look at that, redirects to .today, which is fakeproxied by cloudflare and attempts to force javascript being active.
lobbes: yup. was a bitch to get around
mircea_popescu: the fucking cheek of these fucktards.
lobbes sacrificed an old lappy as the proverbial 'public toilet'; loaded to the hilt with js-crapolade
lobbes: But, once I learn to properly represent www as ASTs we can have the beginnings of a proper republican archive
lobbes: hell, the rockchip may even suffice for a prototype if anything
lobbes bbl, sleep
mircea_popescu: lobbes : curl --cookie "__cfduid=dd16c67421dbb9d1705d6bf28b3fa898c1525574538" -A "TMSR fucks cloudflare" http://archive.today/download/AvNme.zip > AvNme.zip
mircea_popescu: basically, scrape its cookie and then fuck it.
mircea_popescu: i suppose in the end that's what phantom.js is doing anywya.
ave1: And unhappening, I cannot find the broken keys on github... (Also bitbucket ssh-key api gives errors)
mircea_popescu: awww
ave1: For example, https://api.github.com/users/rimolive/keys, has a list of keys, but not the one phunctored. For others the list is simply empty
mircea_popescu: ave1, if you feel like taking a break from diddling ada, feel free to walk the github/bitbucket/we db. spit out keys in the republican format ( http://btcbase.org/log/2016-05-20#1469647 ). it'll take a day or two to put in, and the chances of the new set being devoid of lulz are ~0.
a111: Logged on 2016-05-20 17:48 jurov: it's CSV e,N, comment
ave1: I can bash script. But I've never scraped in any real volume. So if anybody has hints to servers that can be used for this...
mircea_popescu: well, put the rockchip to the test i guess.
spyked: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-10#1811954 <-- can't help but ask: in the biblical sense?
a111: Logged on 2018-05-10 18:40 mircea_popescu: meanwhile lulzdraft upgraded with a "i think i know his mom", also. ima go have lunch, this is a monster.
spyked: (ftr, /me has read some of dood's work, he seems well-regarded by ro math/logic ppl; unfortunately too ensconced in grantola, sorta the bernstein type I guess)
mircea_popescu: in other lulz, phuctor acts as a de facto ssh to gpg bridge now, can download the gpg style keys.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, btw, can the form accept ssh format besides gpg format ?
spyked: ^ would also like to try $feature. digging through the logs for this, I found http://btcbase.org/log/2017-06-16#1671042 , but unfortunately link is broken
a111: Logged on 2017-06-16 15:34 Framedragger: asciilifeform: unless #3 you meant ssh key to rfc4880 pgp converter (http://siphnos.mkj.lt/datadrop/crap-from-scans-to-be-sorted/ssh-to-pgp.py), but again, prolly not. don't remember seeing any phuctor innards tbh (except for fingerprint algo), but could just be me
mircea_popescu: sux
mircea_popescu shall bbl.
spyked: aand found! reposting for context --> http://btcbase.org/log/2016-06-17#1484266 , http://btcbase.org/log/2016-10-04#1552956
a111: Logged on 2016-06-17 19:08 jurov: whoever wants my tool for converting rsa moduli to phuctor, send him to http://explo.yt/post/2016/05/20/Parsing-OpenSSH-RSA-keys-in-Python
a111: Logged on 2016-10-04 19:27 mircea_popescu: there is of course jurov's http://explo.yt/post/2016/05/20/Parsing-OpenSSH-RSA-keys-in-Python
diana_coman: so much weird in that set re key generation; many seem to have e=35 which sounds like one step further from "we like 37" (so why not 35, it's a number just as good as 37!)
diana_coman: (in case anyone wonders: ref there is to google cloud's "/* we like this prime */" )
ave1: I have a key with e==35! This one was generated 9 years ago on a redhat linux of that period.
spyked: heh. same here, genned on african linux cca 2011.
spyked: or was it 2008. I dun remember exactly.
BingoBoingo: Holy shit, I wake up with FAR less crackling in my lungs AND a milestone on the path to reddit bags for the reading!
deedbot: http://qntra.net/2018/05/revived-phuctor-breaks-a-big-pile-of-github-developer-ssh-keys-in-return/ << Qntra - Revived Phuctor Breaks A Big Pile Of Github Developer SSH Keys In Return
diana_coman: BingoBoingo, typos "definte" in http://qntra.net/2018/05/revived-phuctor-breaks-a-big-pile-of-github-developer-ssh-keys-in-return/ and "continuing escaltion " + "Not content to the the big" in http://qntra.net/2018/05/largest-israeli-missile-barrage-in-7-years-of-syrian-war-aggresses-against-iranian-positions/;
BingoBoingo: diana_coman: ty, fxing
asciilifeform: !Q later tell spyked http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812142 << >> http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/j8MGT/?raw=true
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 08:51 spyked: ^ would also like to try $feature. digging through the logs for this, I found http://btcbase.org/log/2017-06-16#1671042 , but unfortunately link is broken
lobbesbot: asciilifeform: The operation succeeded.
asciilifeform: !Q later tell spyked this script takes the format used in jurov's 'phathub' 2016 collection, and produces set of phuctor-compatible keys. do not forget to specify 'legend', the user string, to identify precisely what the key is, otherwise it will remain a mystery forever to reader
lobbesbot: asciilifeform: The operation succeeded.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812141 << phuctor was written very tightly around indexing pgp keys, and demands that all keys be indexable in the same ways ( by e.g. gpg-compat fingerprint ) . additionally , it demands that all keys have a human-readable legend, and ssh key format does not give any field for such.
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 08:49 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, btw, can the form accept ssh format besides gpg format ?
asciilifeform: additionally, the difficulty of keying in random garbage and having it show up as 'key', has worked to date as primitive, yet 100% effective, spam control.
asciilifeform: ( see also old thread , http://btcbase.org/log/2016-05-20#1469676 )
a111: Logged on 2016-05-20 18:00 asciilifeform: try to understand how special cases make complexity of a proggy explode.
asciilifeform: nao ! at some point i'ma rewrite it. again. and build it around 'naked' rsa moduli, and with variant types of indices, etc. but i have nfi when i will get a chance to do this.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812151 << iirc we had the thread; nonprime exponent is cryptologically equivalent to using the smallest prime factor of same as the exponent; the bits set in excess of this, simply help timing/radio/DPA attack to succeed
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 09:42 ave1: I have a key with e==35! This one was generated 9 years ago on a redhat linux of that period.
spyked: ty asciilifeform
lobbesbot: spyked: Sent 48 minutes ago: <asciilifeform> http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812142 << >> http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/j8MGT/?raw=true
lobbesbot: spyked: Sent 47 minutes ago: <asciilifeform> this script takes the format used in jurov's 'phathub' 2016 collection, and produces set of phuctor-compatible keys. do not forget to specify 'legend', the user string, to identify precisely what the key is, otherwise it will remain a mystery forever to reader
asciilifeform: spyked: lemme know if you have any problem.
asciilifeform: spyked: the only even modestly difficult part of the puzzle, afaik, is to enumerate the user set.
asciilifeform: ( i do not know how precisely jurov did it, but can think of several ways )
spyked: asciilifeform, what do you mean by user set?
asciilifeform: spyked: the values to put in equation http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812066
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 03:59 asciilifeform: i.e. retrieve all https://github.com/luser.keys , for all known values of luser
spyked: ah, I didn't think that far yet. I wanna submit some of the ssh keys I have lying around (or see if they were previously submitted).
spyked: re enumeration, it seems that shithub has this in their public API: https://developer.github.com/v3/users/#get-all-users never tried it though
spyked: can confirm it worx: e.g. https://api.github.com/users?since=46 returns users starting from id 47.
asciilifeform somewhat surprised
asciilifeform waves to the cia 'cloud' cluster repeatedly (wai..?) leeching the 193 keyz from last night
mircea_popescu: diana_coman, for a while 35 was actually the default exponent in the circus circle.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812151 << see, exactly.
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 09:42 ave1: I have a key with e==35! This one was generated 9 years ago on a redhat linux of that period.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: at some near future point i'ma put in a 'strange exponents' zoo
asciilifeform: ( there's a few keys with outlandishly huge ones; and even 1 with exponent of... 1 )
mircea_popescu: lol. 1 makes such a great exponent.
asciilifeform: bestest.
mircea_popescu: if hilarity ran for exponent, she'd be a one.
mircea_popescu: btw hanbot, i noticed last night the dogs were lying awake.
mircea_popescu: i suspect they were wondering whether there's a dylsexic agnostic insomniac.
mircea_popescu: "the RSA supercollider and numerical observatory" << ahahaha i like this. a numerical observatory.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812163 << are you saying basically that your indexing of keys depends on spurious metadata that's unrelated to the keys ? anyway, ssh key has a comment field implicit, people often drop an email in there say.
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 13:43 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812141 << phuctor was written very tightly around indexing pgp keys, and demands that all keys be indexable in the same ways ( by e.g. gpg-compat fingerprint ) . additionally , it demands that all keys have a human-readable legend, and ssh key format does not give any field for such.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: most extant ssh pubkeys ( as scanned in the wild ) carry no comment.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812165 << so basically the idea here is "ssh keys are not self signed". still though, the usecase is this : guy ssh-gens a key, wants to see if openssl fucked him.
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 13:44 asciilifeform: additionally, the difficulty of keying in random garbage and having it show up as 'key', has worked to date as primitive, yet 100% effective, spam control.
mircea_popescu: as you know, plenty of them have, as proven by recent publishments.
asciilifeform: aactually the generated keys also carry no self-signature
mircea_popescu: it's not entirely a spurious desire.
asciilifeform: ( how would they )
asciilifeform: the ones that come out of Framedragger's, jurov's, and then asciilifeform's , scripts, i mean
mircea_popescu: right.
mircea_popescu: still, do you see what i mean ?
asciilifeform: certainly
mircea_popescu: well, it's mutual ; i also see what you mean.
asciilifeform: hence http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812168 remark.
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 13:46 asciilifeform: nao ! at some point i'ma rewrite it. again. and build it around 'naked' rsa moduli, and with variant types of indices, etc. but i have nfi when i will get a chance to do this.
mircea_popescu: yes, but even if you were to, the argument is cogent, "lowering the bar to spamming results in exponential spam volumes"
asciilifeform: really excitable folx, can spam already, in principle. but nobody to date bothered.
mircea_popescu: ~possibly~ the solution is to take gpg-only submissions via webform and any-key submissions via an eventual #trilema bot.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, that's exactly the idea, the herd won't bother until you reach the precise epsilon.
asciilifeform: possibly yea
mircea_popescu: but it goes to show what seems to me actually an intrinsic failure of the ssh key format : the fact that it isn't self-signed (rather more generally, the fact that it "segwits" the metadata, having the whole authority mechanism separated from the actual key [and generally implemented as "this key has authority because $user emailed it to me"]) makes it very vulnerable to any failure outside of itself, and impossible to evalua
mircea_popescu: te as a thing-in-itself.
asciilifeform: btw, since we're on subj, http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/eeYZ8/?raw=true << exponent 1
asciilifeform: 11 keys...
mircea_popescu: so at the same time people want to see whether "their" ssh key is fucking them like historically they have ; but we can't distinguish "their" key from garbage.
mircea_popescu: my only concern here is whether this actually invalidates the e, N, comment republican format, as a rsa key format.
mircea_popescu: should really be "self-signed" ?
asciilifeform: i seem to recall a thread where mircea_popescu convincingly described 'self signatures are meaningless'
asciilifeform: currently digging, but not yet found
mircea_popescu: i'd like to review this, i've been thinking about this nonsense ever since you started making noises about the ssh set.
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-16#1522697 << orig mircea_popescu thread
a111: Logged on 2016-08-16 20:59 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform no selfsig.
mircea_popescu rereads
mircea_popescu: the excitement of "let's see if we said something stupid two years ago that informed policy for the interval and now we're biting it" in the morning...
asciilifeform: i did not cite $thread in the american judge 'we already precedented!11' sense, but in 'let's reread'
mircea_popescu: aha.
asciilifeform: also the term 'self signature' as used in kochiana/rfc2440/4880 world , is misleading : if all that were signed were a modulus, one could trivially produce 'self sig' for any modulus/exponent that satisfy the rsa equation, incl. ones generated on the spot. 'self sig' in gpg world is simply attempt to tie commentstrings to keys.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-16#1522739
a111: Logged on 2016-08-16 21:10 mircea_popescu: as it's not acctually correctly designed it 1) creates false sense of security ; 2) creates unnecessary byzantinism and "can't pop the hood on this"
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, indeed. i tell you, i don't see it. the arguments from 2016 prevail, making the ssh-style correct imo.
asciilifeform: rright, recall how (evidently) some pgptron, somewhere, was quite satisfied with 'piltdown man' signatures, ripped out of other keys
mircea_popescu: what gpg tried to do is somehow kludge a whole working republic into their early prototype key "ecosystem". it didn't work in practice, but that aside, it's not actually useful.
asciilifeform: it made for a monumental pile of dysfunctional moving parts.
mircea_popescu: it just creates a pile of counterproductive complexity.
mircea_popescu: right.
mircea_popescu: so there's no way out of it, http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-16#1522722 <<-->> http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812114 reflect over the ages.
a111: Logged on 2016-08-16 21:03 mircea_popescu: it's not "the sks server" that is retarded. is the concept of machine-spread rsa key that's retarded ; much in the way of "machine-generated trust", be it embodied in "dao" or "colored coins" or "safe bitbet"
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 05:01 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, it seems to me the factors ~aren;t~ normally distributed.
mircea_popescu: o damn, wrong link lol.
asciilifeform: and the ( let's charitably suppose something other than plain wrecking ) motivation for the very notion, was 'defense against key substitution' which is really an attempt to get around the need for wot
asciilifeform: which is the ultimate folly
mircea_popescu: so there's no way out of it, http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-16#1522722 <<-->> http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812214 reflect over the ages.
a111: Logged on 2016-08-16 21:03 mircea_popescu: it's not "the sks server" that is retarded. is the concept of machine-spread rsa key that's retarded ; much in the way of "machine-generated trust", be it embodied in "dao" or "colored coins" or "safe bitbet"
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 15:49 mircea_popescu: ~possibly~ the solution is to take gpg-only submissions via webform and any-key submissions via an eventual #trilema bot.
asciilifeform: there we go.
mircea_popescu: basically, exactly like you say, we have a personhood mechanism, it'll have to be used. can't sit down and "make a mechanical friend JUST FOR THIS ONE CASE"
asciilifeform: some things are not mechanizable, and whoever tries -- will pay the price.
mircea_popescu: the impossibility of mechanical friendship isn't case by case, it's a fundamental problem.
mircea_popescu: well, this is then what even gets one out of bed in the morning : the hope shining through the dread, that even should something from years ago have to be reviewed on grounds of suspected stupidity, there's a shot it may turn out to have actually been quite correct.
asciilifeform: this is quite related to the 'subkeys' thread also.
asciilifeform: certain chores repeatedly invite disastrous attempts at mechanization.
mircea_popescu: indeed.
mircea_popescu: !#s hole night in
a111: 18 results for "hole night in", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=hole%20night%20in
asciilifeform: ( witness the neverending supply of lost souls who still demand 'pgptron built into email reader' or even automatic signing of this or that )
mircea_popescu: same people who get "excited" about "paying with credit cards". "it's so much easier!!!". and these days "near field" or w/e they're doing.
asciilifeform: funnily enuff i got stuck behind one of these in a little shop in BingoBoingostan : the lulz was in that the modem in the register was slow enuff that cc folx were ~slower~ than ones paying with ordinary money
mircea_popescu: it's universally the case. the only reason it's not obvious in the us is that everyone there is poor, nobody has anyt money.
asciilifeform: in us it is worse : cachiers are often met with who cannot count, and if you pay with money, you will wait
asciilifeform: ( and if you are certain places, like petrol station, you will stand for 20+min in a queue which cc users never see )
mircea_popescu: twas not my experience, but then again it's been what, 15 years.
asciilifeform: was palpably different place, 15y ago.
asciilifeform: ( and this is speaking merely of asciilifeform's locale )
mircea_popescu: that bad, huh.
mircea_popescu: to think, my impression then was, "pity it all went to shit".
asciilifeform: physical shops selling nonperishables , are visibly dying off, nuked by lulazon
asciilifeform: errywhere they turn into 'space for lease' (never gets filled, as prices are deliberately kept at lunar heights to keep rent up for remaining tenants)
mircea_popescu: so what, buildng a great country of 90% dormitories and 10% "1, mccain memorial law enforcement monumental avenue" cubical concrete abominations ?
ben_vulpes: dude just the chip and pin crap is intolerably slow.
asciilifeform: cardboard dormitories.
asciilifeform: ( cement, too costly )
asciilifeform: cubicle hells still cement, for nao, but i already spotted a few new constructions with gypsum outer walls
BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> funnily enuff i got stuck behind one of these in a little shop in BingoBoingostan : the lulz was in that the modem in the register was slow enuff that cc folx were ~slower~ than ones paying with ordinary money << Serious quality of life issue here. The awful part is the locals CAN'T learn to use the pin pads and have to try 3+ times
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: re bank cards : it gets funnier : in usa, many folx dun actually qualify to ~borrow~ moneys, and their cards are imitations, they have to pre-fill'em at specially designated places, in exchange for ordinary money; and it actually ~costs~ something, on top of the fill
mircea_popescu: oh, i know.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, money is way faster than the cards, though.
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: no argument there
BingoBoingo: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812195 << Well, who else is doing interesting observations on wild numbers?
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 15:42 mircea_popescu: "the RSA supercollider and numerical observatory" << ahahaha i like this. a numerical observatory.
asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: chix at princeton!1111
asciilifeform: or was it dour old d00d in tourist hat.
mircea_popescu: in strict, physical terms. i can peel a coupla bills off the roll way before anyone can a) take the card b) orient it to machine slit ; c) slide it through ; d) wait for data to run back and forth to visa servers (include here the pro-rated delay of "servers down" shenanigans) ; e) get me to "sign" like 1100 period barbarians the f) slip of paper it printed and spit out etc.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: dun forget the 'dial, at 300 baud' in orcistan
ben_vulpes: http://logs.bvulpes.com/trilema?d=2018-5-11#353878 << i found one made of brick! couldn't believe the thermal inertia.
mimisbrunnr: Logged on 2018-05-11 16:06 asciilifeform: cardboard dormitories.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: they're building a buncha communal flats over here, they all get decorative fauxbrick panels over the gypsum
asciilifeform: ( they come on truck, in pre-cut panels )
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, my place in tm, had double layered brick walls, proper style. by the time the outside of the inner wall warmed up the sun was setting.
mircea_popescu: a forgotten art, this, to match heating speed of materials with day length.
danielpbarron: Victims include developers at big companies such as Microsoft, Facebook, Eventbrite, and a bunch of Neet employees (probably used the same weak tool) << Guy thinks "neet" is a company?
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron, discussion in harem, "isn't that too much linking on the neet explanation ?" "you'll see".
danielpbarron: http://archive.is/CYbra >> Security researcher finds 192 weakly-factored GitHub SSH keys.
mircea_popescu: can't wait for her to wake up, now.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: in other lollies, 64377 keys where exp=3
mircea_popescu: these people went to school, beating them over the head repeatedly with any reference is just table stakes, says nothing about eventual outcomes.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, odds are, antiques. exp was 3 on "cheap" systems throughout the 90s.
asciilifeform: (i.e. bleichenbacher-able )
asciilifeform: and, interestingly, ~not~ all antiques, a great many e.g. 4096-bit ones
mircea_popescu: ahahaha what.
asciilifeform: aha.
mircea_popescu: christ on a cracker, the e=3 n=4096 bit key. who makes such things.
asciilifeform: plenty of lulz left in the lulzmag.
ben_vulpes: ohay is there a crackernyooz link?
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: '... and a bunch of Neet employees (probably used the same weak tool)' << waaat
asciilifeform pictures conglomerate, Neet Heavy Industries, Ltd, with legions of slaves
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, check me out, i made it, security researcher now.
mircea_popescu: !#s calificare la locul de munca.
a111: 0 results for "calificare la locul de munca.", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=calificare%20la%20locul%20de%20munca.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, how was this in sovrussian, "trained in the workplace" ?
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'made it' in 2015, recall, https://archive.li/7OxKW
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: this one is nominally double-walled; haven't cut through it...yet.
asciilifeform: the one where 'boeck confirms, not true!' etc
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, oh oh, i gorfot.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, old friend showed me some wonders... they have cheap enough US machines to use for building valuations now.
mircea_popescu: ridoinculous beeping doohickey, too. i was like "so... is it a boy ?"
asciilifeform: what does such a thing do ? or is this the mechanized dowsing rod thing
ben_vulpes: interesting; i've got to install a hood in the kitchen; so will learn the truth without any electronics.
ben_vulpes: (how the kitchen came to be without a hood is a mystery i do not think i shall ever understand, given that the dood ran cat5 and coax to every room. what, no women cooking in his life or something?)
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: believe or not, none of the places i've ever lived in, had a 'honest' kitchen exhaust (i.e. with actual pipe to the outside world)
asciilifeform: always it is the ersatz, instead, with the charcoal filter (that gives out in coupla months)
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, it does two things. one is that it can mostly distinguish concrete from brick from wood and so on, it has the patterns of specific materials. the other is that it can evaluate "decay", in the sense of how uniform or nonuniform the wall is. so once it decided it's wood it can tell you ~how old ; and if concrete ~how fractured so on.
mircea_popescu: ample potential for hilarious misreads, which is why it's not dispensed with the human operator yet. but way the fuck faster and cheaper than proof hole drilling.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: i'll do you one just a hair more ridiculous: this place has a whole-house evacuator that "well you can just run the whole-house fan when you're cooking!"
ben_vulpes: motherfucker because i want to dump my entire heated air mass every time the girl fries something
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: aaa the radar thing. funny story with these, the old-world version of this was the gamma-radiograph. in su they used them to evaluate cured cement prior to finishing a block of flat. aaand sometimes they'd forget the sr-90 brick inside the wall, and roast several generations of tenants
mircea_popescu: lol. i heard the legends.
ben_vulpes: oof.
mircea_popescu: not very likely, though, sr brick was $$$.
asciilifeform: not as if the idjit who dropped it into the cement, had to pay
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, this was ultrasound, but same principle.
asciilifeform: hm i misremembered, the most famous incident, in kramatorsk ('80s) involved a cs-137 brick.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, they came on a signature form thing though! http://btcbase.org/log/2014-11-15#922644
a111: Logged on 2014-11-15 00:28 asciilifeform: one would read instructions. another, turn a wrench, whatever. third would check that 2 corresponds to 1. then, all three sign under that step in recipe.
asciilifeform: but otherwise as-described.
ben_vulpes: anyone have a grahamnews account? submit the phuctoring?
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, they can't do it themselves ?
mircea_popescu: let the aspirants to relevancy work for their aspirations.
ben_vulpes: I HUNGER FOR LOLS
mircea_popescu: so then make an acct lol.
asciilifeform: https://archive.li/kNiIH << for the curious.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, odds are very much no women cooking in his life. it is universally my experience esl girls do not even conceptuialize such a miracle as "make your own food" is possible.
mircea_popescu: i mean, that nut with the "mac on cheese on pizza awesum!" is actually adventurous and far sighted with reference to her peer group. sad as that may sound.
asciilifeform: it is a curable condition. ( but not quickly, and not painlessly )
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: sure, dood is like sixty five tho.
mircea_popescu: not that slow either. the mentally livelier ones REALLY get motivated by the "make something with own hands" cheap and early successes.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, for the record, if your place needs evacuation every time girl fries something you might consider a) getting better oil and b) not smoking the shit out of it.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: the comments in heathen pits the last coupla times were so predictable, as to be imho complete snoar. but who knows.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: make boeck work for his pay, why not.
asciilifeform: in related noose, today's phuctor www l0gz include campus of microshit, arsebook, etc; prolly already on conveyor for 'consensus farm'
mircea_popescu: i must say im really impressed with phuctor 3.0 webatron. sensibly more responsive than prev.
asciilifeform: this one actually scales.
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: nono, i exaggerate, grossly. that said, i haven't figured out how to bake a chicken without a cloud of chicken-scent emerging and permeating the domus on every basting.
mircea_popescu: well... the way they do it here is that you take it out to the "rancho" (basically, concrete poles with a roof) and charcoal it there.
mircea_popescu: i am a convert to the method.
ben_vulpes: sounds spiffy!
ben_vulpes has been drawing up plans for a permanent gas/charcoal combo griller
mircea_popescu: the very relaxed attitude to fire among these people is a joy to behold. a) anyone can start a lawn fire at any time they feel like, and there's daily sirens from firetrucks rushing to reign in the more successful attempts.
mircea_popescu: b) go to the beach, want to start a fire ? by all means. wanna make a fire in your yard ? yes please. is there a fire going ? cool!
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: place gets enough rain that the whole thing is unlikely to go up at once right?
mircea_popescu: not really, can get pretty dry in dry season.
ben_vulpes: wildfires at all? suffers from the northwestern us problem of excess tinder buildup at all?
mircea_popescu: however a) they build out of steel beams and brick and b) they're built out of solid "don't give a fuck". so...
trinque had a nice outing with the girl once, drove 4runner out onto the beach, fucked the night away, cooked breakfast in a fire-pit we made
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, suffers from it moderately. there's occasional wildfire, but nothing like california.
mircea_popescu: trinque, lovely innit!
trinque: indeed
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: sounds like they let it burn off, which'd keep it moderate. the problem usgderps suffer from is *not* letting it burn.
mircea_popescu: charcoal sack is now a mandatory car trunk item. at the rate i'm going i might actually next buy a truck.
ben_vulpes pictures mircea_popescu and crew in a unimog
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, also not the same flora here. the wood is about half-value if i had to guess, caloric-wise.
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, unimog-LIMO!!
ben_vulpes: aah this changes things
trinque: lol
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: don't get high sided my man
mircea_popescu: WITH WINGS
ben_vulpes: or or unimog limo with ultra lift kit
mircea_popescu: see ?
ben_vulpes: and three winches
ben_vulpes: and seven wenches
mircea_popescu: ahoy hoy hoy
mircea_popescu: and a bottle of rum
asciilifeform: kamaz!
ben_vulpes: this begs to be ensongified
mircea_popescu: (the bottle of venezuelan rum, btw, has been a standard mandatory for the car for a year now)
ben_vulpes: deeeelux road soda
mircea_popescu: "do you drink and drive ?" "yes. i drink -- she drives."
ben_vulpes: poor asciilifeform, one begins to understand his resentment of the "bars with acres of parking"
asciilifeform: http://www.arms-expo.ru/upload/medialibrary/648/648f42885f02861489fa6bce1a980035.jpg << subj
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, ahahaha, is that a locomotive temple to my penis ?
asciilifeform: kamaz. ( to be fair, they make a buncha different ones )
mircea_popescu: talk about enforcing the patriarchy. DICKTRUCK
asciilifeform: http://kamaz.ru .
mircea_popescu: "it will ruin your shit. literally, by which i mean anally."
mircea_popescu: "you know how after you're constipated for like the rest of the day ? shit has been ruined!"
asciilifeform: they make, e.g., topol-m launcher, iirc
asciilifeform: ( speaking of gigantic cocks )
mircea_popescu: aha.
asciilifeform: in running-lulz, www hits from arsebook-owned ip ranges in 4 countries, and counting
asciilifeform: ( i suppose they ended up with the boecking job this time )
mircea_popescu: are you having a fun over there ? lol.
asciilifeform: slow-burning fun in 1 eye
asciilifeform: ( i still have nfi, fwiw, who/where linked to it, to which heathens, possibly from mircea_popescu's logs later we will know some of it )
asciilifeform: latest : stanford campus
asciilifeform: ( i'm betting, it's on reddit somewhere )
mircea_popescu: discord!
asciilifeform: lol
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, anyway, yeah, the "wood"... i mean they have all these overgrown grasses which to ~them~ appear woody, but taking an axe to a palm is not so unlike taking down a movie set in anger.
mircea_popescu: you can hold without effort humongous looking clubs, too, it's practically speaking made of packing peanuts.
mircea_popescu: also very large cacti count as "wooden" in this sense. but i mean gimme a break, yes wood is supposed to float, but not in acetone ffs.
asciilifeform: https://archive.li/O1H7v << in re pertinent shithub oldies
asciilifeform: https://blog.benjojo.co.uk/post/auditing-github-users-keys << the horse's mouth re ^ ; orig article by the orig 'henninger' who 'did' the experiment (i.e. experiment-stopper ) and (not)published
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, wait, so they claim they PURGED the debian keys ? in 2015 ?
mircea_popescu: my my is this embarassing then.
asciilifeform: only for the Anointed, naturally
asciilifeform: ( ftr asciilifeform suspects that 'debianized' primes are sometimes emplace by ~current-day~ proggies; the debianization is 'deniable cover' of the exact kind usg luvvvs like delish candy )
asciilifeform: *emplaced
mircea_popescu: not entirely impossible.
asciilifeform: observe, every effort is made to extend , somehow, the life of that particular escapade
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: typo in your article, 'Fritz' archive link goes to the 'innergap' chick
mircea_popescu: oopsie. lessee
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, fixt. ty.
asciilifeform: in other lullies, https://archive.li/1QxgC >> 'Decompiling the ElectrumPro stealware'
asciilifeform: 'The "electrum dot com" scheme is taking that attack further: the scammers have managed to take control of the dot com domain, and they have developed a website with a slightly different design and logo. The authors have been claiming that they are developing a legitimate fork of the Electrum project, and that they are trying to improve user experience. The owners of "electrum dot com" went as far as to claim that they are "currently
asciilifeform: undergoing a public security audit which will be released soon".' etc
asciilifeform: ( run moar binturds!111 )
phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812396 << amongst all the different build variations they also have a shiny version that's more palatable for foreigners that they build for dakar rally. been taking first place there for couple of years http://videoscars.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/here-come-the-kamaz-dakar-2016.jpg
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 17:05 asciilifeform: kamaz. ( to be fair, they make a buncha different ones )
phf: http://image.trucktrend.com/f/28165691+re0+ar0+st0/1008dp_03%2bdakar_rally_kamaz_dakar_t4_race%2bcenter_of_gravity.jpg
ben_vulpes: heh heh heh nothing like seeing five tons on 1.25 wheels
ben_vulpes: take me out to the deeesert/romp around on the flaaaats/burning oil and lighting off guns/fuck all the liberals i'm gonna have fun/cause it's root root root for the germans/if the diesels get neutered it's a shaaaaaame/cause it's one! two! three! strikes you're out in the us! penitentiary! game!
phf: ben_vulpes: i'd say 1/3 of image search results is with that thing airborne
ben_vulpes: it's the best shot!
ben_vulpes: comic juxtaposition of large mass bouncing gaily around at speed
phf: yeah, dakar rally for trucks is a european take on monster truck rally thing, not as larger than life over the top, but taps the same kind of feelings
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, and this is different from the bitcoin dot com scheme how ?
mircea_popescu: !!up phatcat
deedbot: phatcat voiced for 30 minutes.
mircea_popescu: phf, i thought dakar is in africa.
BingoBoingo: What is Africa but a European playground where the toys took over the playing?
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812441 << ~same play gets put on regularly, i dun even recall just which # iteration this one is
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 19:38 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, and this is different from the bitcoin dot com scheme how ?
hanbot: hey danielpbarron (or any other mp-wp users with 'classic' theme goin'), assuming you're using mp's antispam, wouldja mind pasting your themes/classic/comments.php for me so i can see how you're handling the $suffix? differs from the 'default' i'm using, but i'd like to include a fix for it in a comments patch.
mircea_popescu: so maybe not ~exactly~ same flavour ; but more of http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-07#1810716
a111: Logged on 2018-05-07 15:15 mircea_popescu: meanwhile in mean words, https://78.media.tumblr.com/8d9625677c87c6938052cc801b0ef9d5/tumblr_okr5poCICc1vc2tefo1_1280.jpg
mircea_popescu: ie, "all these naked chicks can't even figure out where the praying beads are"
hanbot: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812288 << yeah, YOU can. way before pretty much anyone else, and certainly way the fuck before the masses can a) be told that yes, in fact, the act of purchasing something involves them paying! b) thereby realize they will have to retrieve monies c) emit a mournful moo d) reach into bottomless purse/euromanpurse/dip hoof into each of eleventeen pockets e) find a button! f) remember that bunion/ill aunt/weather s
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 16:25 mircea_popescu: in strict, physical terms. i can peel a coupla bills off the roll way before anyone can a) take the card b) orient it to machine slit ; c) slide it through ; d) wait for data to run back and forth to visa servers (include here the pro-rated delay of "servers down" shenanigans) ; e) get me to "sign" like 1100 period barbarians the f) slip of paper it printed and spit out etc.
hanbot: ystem they were going to tell the cashier about....
mircea_popescu: well there is that.
mircea_popescu: then again, moo moos have no need of money.
mircea_popescu: let them be nude and happy outdoors, chained to the respective chainposts.
mircea_popescu: incidentally asciilifeform you ever read http://trilema.com/2011/paria/ ?
asciilifeform: hmm dunthinkso
mircea_popescu: if you translate ima do a diff.
lobbes: Few weeks ago I was trying to buy a power supply cable and didn't want to wait for lulazon to ship. Tried half-dozen local shops, both "big box retailers" and "mom n pop computer stores"; -none- had any in stock >> http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812272
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 16:16 asciilifeform: physical shops selling nonperishables , are visibly dying off, nuked by lulazon
lobbes: Sad state
trinque: no microcenter or fry's in lobbestan?
lobbes: Looks like there's a fry's in Raleigh, roughly three hours from me o.0
lobbes: "Charlotte's got a lot" my foot
mircea_popescu: heh. it occurs to me i've not lived in a city smaller than 1mn in YEARS
mircea_popescu: and i still complain of how fucking rural they are.
mircea_popescu: civilisation just isn't what it used to be, 1mn lazy asses don't sum >0.
lobbes: I will say, I've lived in New England, Ohio, and now here. And, believe it or not, imo the people of Ohio trump the usefulness of people here by a large margin
lobbes: But teh weather here is so much better, so I can't complain too much I guess
mircea_popescu: lobbes, somehow that cable reminded me of the http://trilema.com/2016/industria-argentina-or-my-life-among-the-tribal-savages/ ; at least yours don't burn down in hand.
lobbes: 0.o
lobbes: Hey, at least there is that!
asciilifeform: oh hey BingoBoingo , recall the power cable in BingoBoingostan ? where we had to splice it , because in whole country (apparently!) the correct one could not be had ?
asciilifeform: lobbes: even something like, e.g., m3 screws, is (afaik) sold in ~exactly 1~ physical shop in wash dc region .
asciilifeform: ~nobody buys such thing from walkable-in shops, around here
mircea_popescu: tell the truth, nobody buys such a thing. period.
mircea_popescu: if it doesn't come out of plastic and it doesn't go on pizza, it's not interesting.
asciilifeform: to the nearest whole number -- definitely
mircea_popescu: lobbes, incidentally, i've noticed the people's subjective reported dissatisfaction is one of the best proxies for local suckitude. ~100% of romanians agreed that romania sucks, 1988, and as a result romania went from ~gabon to ~austria in 30 years. meanwhile columbia people agreed with themselves "they love their country", and columbia went from columbia to columbia in the interval. nicaragua idem.
mircea_popescu: and argentina, or the us, full to the brim of imbeciles thinking "the whole world is in awe of our example", went from top 5 to worst decile in the same interval.
mircea_popescu: i dun recall EVER hearing "carolina is the suck" in local drawl ; but people from ohio will literally ask you "what, and you came here ?!" as if they can't conceive anyone who isn't born there being found there even momentarily.
asciilifeform: contented mooing, naturally is what cattle do. people -- grumble and build things
asciilifeform: ( incidentally, if you think m3 ~screw~ is impossible to find in shops here -- try a ~tap~. one time asciilifeform broke a m3 tap and wanted a replacement quickly, and like complete idiot tried to buy ~in shops~. result : wasted weekend )
danielpbarron: !Q later tell hanbot http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/4x7iw/?raw=true << i also had to make changes in some other file. there's one that makes the form and another that receives the POST data
lobbesbot: danielpbarron: The operation succeeded.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: does not call ahead?
asciilifeform: waiwat
asciilifeform: call where
ben_vulpes: these physical retail outlets
asciilifeform: shops ? dun make me laugh. they have nfi re inventory of $thing-nobody-bought-in-20yrs even if you walk in. AND they automagically list 'orderable online only' in same catalogue as what is physically present.
lobbes: This was precisely my experience. I remember thinking how *refreshing* it was to come out of the heart of pantsuitlandia (taxachusetts) where everyone was up their own ass in "we are so progressive and enlightened.", to ohio where everyone was "yeah... we pretty much suck. Sorry you have to be here" >> http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812483
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 20:33 mircea_popescu: i dun recall EVER hearing "carolina is the suck" in local drawl ; but people from ohio will literally ask you "what, and you came here ?!" as if they can't conceive anyone who isn't born there being found there even momentarily.
lobbes: There's something to this "locals blinded by pretense fall into uselessness" heuristic, I think
ben_vulpes: us, apparently, is many different countries smooshed into one.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: i somehow get 'em to leave the register and check inventory manually
ben_vulpes: be damned if i'm going to drive around all day on the offchance they have a thing
asciilifeform: the message i got errywhere was, unspokenly, 'you gotta be deeply mentally ill to be buying this not on www'
asciilifeform: and they're right. it can't be had , i suspect, on this entire shore, in shops. ( for various values of 'it' )
ben_vulpes: sure; i recently got 2 pair of tall jackstands, delivered to house, for ~.6 the cost of item at store which was even shorter
asciilifeform: recall how ratshack co. finally died, despite charging first 10x and then 20 and then 50x... for parts
lobbes: It took some explaining to Best Buy lady on the phone that I a) was not looking for laptop power cord and b) I didn't need the whole power supply, just the cord
ben_vulpes: last time i could be assured of walking out the door and getting a tool (not part!) that i needed was in nyc
lobbes: To finally get answer: "we dun sell just cords"
ben_vulpes: lobbes: especially the bigbox(tm) stores, they don't sell anything nonstandard.
asciilifeform: i assume we're speaking of a iso power cord ?
asciilifeform: what's moar standard than that
ben_vulpes: "who would ever buy one of those without the power supply for the snowflake laptop?"
ben_vulpes: it's an industrial item, not consumer.
ben_vulpes: and unless you're an industrial large enough to warrant snapon deliveries weekly, you better be stocked preemptively.
ben_vulpes: no money in selling parts/strange to the herd.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812496 << hey, that'sd been the official republican worldview since 4evar.
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 20:54 ben_vulpes: us, apparently, is many different countries smooshed into one.
ben_vulpes: they get completely mass produced healthcare/parts/food/'mobile experiences' and fuck'em.
asciilifeform: ben_vulpes: astronomical rents, i suspect, also play a part. it is ~impossible to stay open if you stock anything that doesn't move continuously. specialist shops are the first to die.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812515 << this is exactly how soviet economy died, too!
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 21:01 ben_vulpes: they get completely mass produced healthcare/parts/food/'mobile experiences' and fuck'em.
mircea_popescu: "engineered the total immersive soviet citizen experience"
asciilifeform: ( once in a veeeery long time, asciilifeform runs into some land-that-time-forgot where a greybeard owns the building and there are motherfucking blisterpacked z80's, 6502's, etc. hanging there, in dark yellowed plastic, since 1982... )
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, next this happens, invite them here lol.
asciilifeform: ^ these tend to keep 'banker's hours' tho, and the next time you come back, there's a carpet shop in there, because d00d finally died...
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: different mechanism: here everyone "making apps", slicing open appendices are ~exactly the same in the head, so everything they produce converges to ~the same thing
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: the last one in my list recently evaporated. but will file for future ref
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, what difference do you perceive then ?
ben_vulpes: grand network of corporations and wall street will ensure that americans are "stepped down gently" a la the photosynthesis process, with maximum $anything extracted over the long term
ben_vulpes: mircea_popescu: hard to tell, never got to experience su glory days
mircea_popescu: they seem indistinguishable to me, "marxism-leninism" or "awareness, eco-friendliness, blabla" serving as a specific sort of distance-only schelling points -- ie they only work at a distance.
mircea_popescu: $agent could answer yes/no whether $measure is leninist or bourgeois, appropriate or racisthateful, but only for the least interesting classes of $measures.
asciilifeform: the diff is that the us folx are bonsaikittens and, for the most part, actually believe in their bunkum. and can't read, write, count, feed selves without ~short~ (oh noez, 3km walk -- death!11) path to mcshittrough
mircea_popescu: soviets actually believed.
asciilifeform: i dun think i ever met those
mircea_popescu: and couldn't read, count, etc. just, the mass of them wasn't anywhere any precious sankt petersburg windowsill flowers ever met.
ben_vulpes: perhaps i misconcieve of the industrial processes, and could benefit from experience, but i labor under the apprehension that there was "teh one su car, designed by su factory" whereas american product is "ten stanford cucks who think the exact same way writing the exact same banking app that chase will release as a feature in two years, written by their peers who took salaries instead of grahams
ben_vulpes: dickintheass"
mircea_popescu: the soviets of russia, much like the soviets of america, very insistently alfabetized the herd ; but lacked the electronic means to plug them in, all they had was electric. and as a result, "people's radio theatre"
ben_vulpes: designed by su department of designing The Right Car, i mean
mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes, not really ; in the early gosplan days they even had competition, as alf aptly pointed out during some previous discussion.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: people -- read. ( and to some extent even in modern ru, this survives, it is actually possible to stay afloat economically there as a non-crown-anointed - i.e. not-'bestsellerlist' writer, even today )
mircea_popescu: the most visible standardization (the hruscheba) is actually also the most defensible behaviour in economic terms (and not so different from us response to same problem). prefab was the way post ww2.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: in late-gosplan days also had competition. ( life is a bit moar complicated than the cartoon su )
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, people read in united soviets also, you should see the trainfulls of people with crappy pulp in hand.
mircea_popescu: "mysteries" and whatnot.
ben_vulpes: kindle fulla fifty shades of the same smut
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: largely replaced , on same trains, with pnoje-gazers in recent decade
asciilifeform: watching lolcats
mircea_popescu: i don't think there was ever a system "dedicated to man" that managed to get man to think, though. man will not think, would rather take rape than math questions.
asciilifeform: there's a vernier knob.
mircea_popescu: i am unpersuaded by this theory.
asciilifeform: on top of this, there is the choice of whether to permit illiterates to strut about and pretend to civilization.
asciilifeform: in su -- not ( for the most part, managerial caste is separate convo ) not permitted.
mircea_popescu: and what was the whole "worker class" and aparatchick class but illiterates strutting ?
mircea_popescu: the fundamental pretense of the ~soviet~, in the original sense of the term, is that a group of imbeciles can nevertheless make decisions on the basis of their misapprehension of the environment.
asciilifeform suspects that apparatchiks are ~same in ~all times/places
mircea_popescu: so the soldier's soviet will decide which way to charge this evening.
mircea_popescu: this is entirely not different from both "i know obscenity when i see it" and "hi i named rajshit from injun and can moderate your tube sir!"
asciilifeform: this was a lunacy dangled as a lure for idjits ('abolish rank in army!' 'abolish money') and dispensed with more or less immediately during ru civil war .
mircea_popescu: dispensed, not from a good life.
mircea_popescu: they'd have stuck to it if it even vaguely promised to not entirely kill them. because, substantially, that's what the socialism was always about -- the pretense that the whore decides when and how the soldier fucks her.
asciilifeform: dispensed because folx in the driver's seat are, as a rule , never so dumb as to actually drink the 'left' hokum. it is a lure.
mircea_popescu: i guess. though i suspect it's a sad life to play the transvestite as only avenue to getting laid.
asciilifeform: iirc mircea_popescu had a spiffy article, re 'grifters', and where specifically 'lenin played the lure sucker for stalin's grift'
mircea_popescu: sure.
asciilifeform: ( anybody recall the specific piece ? )
mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2014/so-the-dollar-vigilante-scam-ring-is-going-to-jail/
asciilifeform: yes ! it ^
asciilifeform: there ~are~ plenty of folx who walk, talk, even pretend to do work (in cafe, somewhere, or holding stop signs, or whichever) while earnestly believing in 'equalism', 'abolish ranks', etc. ~but~ these won't become even city dogcatcher, much less fuhrer, simply too much brain damage required, it gets in the way
asciilifeform: sorta why, imho, folx who lament 'and then cruel cynical grifter stalin took over' have it backwards.
asciilifeform: hook -- baited, fish -- bit.
asciilifeform: by the time of the http://btcbase.org/log/2017-12-24#1757902 incident, whole edifice was more or less thoroughly hollowed out and had approx as much genuine 'leftism' left inside, as the stuffed heads in a hunting lodge have meat
a111: Logged on 2017-12-24 16:11 asciilifeform: kurchatov, supposedly, sat and thought, and few minutes later answered, 'perhaps from philosophical pov this'd be consistent. but then we will have to forget about obtaining the bomb.'
asciilifeform: ( took 3+ rounds of meat grinder, too )
asciilifeform: to apply mircea_popescu's classic 'thrown brick' model : stalin cleaned up the place, and threw the brick. which stayed , for a short while, in the air, in the form of 1950s-60s techno-extravaganza , rocketry, nukes, etc; then brick, engineless and wingless, on downward trajectory.
asciilifeform: and funnily enuff brick has not even hit bottom yet.
asciilifeform: such was the force of the throw...
asciilifeform brb,meat
mircea_popescu: this no-left-in-socialism point is particularly visible if you look at the case of the republica "socialista" romania. from the 60s onwards it was run VERY MUCH on capitalist basis, accumulating wealth, if undistributed, and ekeing itself a tiny colonial empire in the arab lands etc.
mircea_popescu: the signs are everywhere, you go to colombia, look through the paperwork of the embassy, it strikes. it's quite universal.
mircea_popescu: but this is a little like saying "kid pretending to be holding breath is lying". duh. how the fuck is socialism, or however you call the attempt to embody idiocy, supposed to survive in the strictly non-socialist reality ?
mircea_popescu: either it lies, or it dies. there's no third way.
danielpbarron: http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/YG6Y7/?raw=true << the tweet has grown, now featuring hanno
mircea_popescu: srsly, they only got one muppet ?
BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: I do remember that glorious rooftop surgery. With birds that could be heard by not seen
BingoBoingo: This hanno guy: "this guy has made similar claims in the past and they were always wrong. if you want my advice: don't trust this unless someone has independently checked it."
asciilifeform: bahaha what took him whole day.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: seems like same muppet still assigned to the case.
asciilifeform: ( why would he get swapped out, if 'still works' )
trinque: lol what claim? go, divide.
asciilifeform: naaa trinque , seee, only Certified usg.adademitards may divide Authoritatively
asciilifeform: ditto multiply
asciilifeform: no good citizen would carry out a long division on a terrorist's instigation!1!!
asciilifeform: and besides, remember , it was Cosmic Rays and at the same time There Are No Broken Keys and incidentally cosmicrays and remember , craigwright is satoshi, and oh oh bigblocks.
danielpbarron: more from hanno >> http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/qustP/?raw=true >> It seems there's a new "trilema factored some keys" story floating around. Take my advice: don't embarrass yourself by retweeting or spreading it, this guy has spread several bogus stories of that kind in the past.
asciilifeform: just when i was about to think 'where is boeck! has he died'
asciilifeform: i bet d00d is pissed, too, phone rang and nao he has to crank out the fud, rather than his light daily routine of nsa.burning xen 'bugs'
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-11#1812579 << it doesn't. however mythical beasts do not need to physiologically add up and live. on other hand, ~socialism-flavoured~ ( or with just about any other flavour, shinto-flavoured or confucius-flavored worx just as well.. ) fuhrerprinzip -- does work.
a111: Logged on 2018-05-11 21:31 mircea_popescu: but this is a little like saying "kid pretending to be holding breath is lying". duh. how the fuck is socialism, or however you call the attempt to embody idiocy, supposed to survive in the strictly non-socialist reality ?
asciilifeform: kurchatov being a great demo case; he had the authority to behead. laboratory -- worked. ( and not merely via 'copy leaked design', the ~indigenous~ nuke was crafted in parallel with the copied 'rds-1' , and subsequently went to production )
asciilifeform: the canonical mircea_popescu piece re subj of thread being imho http://trilema.com/2017/cemetery-junction/#selection-87.181-111.338
asciilifeform: '...Stupid people organize and through collective action arrive at "consensus", which is batshit nonsense filtered by idiots out of their own ass, entirely unrelated to any kind of reality. And then they attempt to force it upon the actual people... It's not annoying because it works, which of fucking course it doesn't, but because the only way to deal with them is to exploit the fact that they're so fucking stupid, they can't tell t
asciilifeform: he difference between the item that they claim they want and any other item labeled the way they want' in particular.
mircea_popescu: sure, but one would propose howsoever flavoured cyanide is nevertheless cyanide, and similarily penicillin, and etcetera. scarcely can see the point of even discussing the flavouring.
asciilifeform: fuhrerprinzip works. is the only thing that works.
asciilifeform: whether cyanide-flavoured, or apple-flavoured.
mircea_popescu: whether cyanide-however flavoured or penicillin-however flavoured or etcetera.
mircea_popescu: unlike flavouring, cyanide does something.
asciilifeform: not a fan of almond cake, i take it...
mircea_popescu: hey, my recipe for apricot jam has half a dozen cracked seeds in there per jar.
asciilifeform: http://lemur59.ru/node/8786 << with pr0n, 'for the voracious'
mircea_popescu: nb
asciilifeform: ( re 'rds-1' )
mircea_popescu: the drawings of overturned tanks are lulzy
asciilifeform: product of the seekrecy cult , which was every bit as bullheadedly idiotic as in usa
mircea_popescu: aha
asciilifeform: ( the orig pics are almost certainly in archive somewhere, and simply not printed )
mircea_popescu: http://lemur59.ru/sites/default/files/images/%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B7%D1%80%D1%83%D1%88%D0%B5%D0%BD%D0%B8%D1%8F0003.JPG << also this is strictly incorrect.
mircea_popescu: the rubble is on the wrong side for the implicit direction of the blast by what's left standing.
trinque: http://www.tsarbomba.org/images/tsar%20bom%20explosion.jpg << always thought this one was real pretty.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: aaaactually!
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: this is a classic luleffect, rubble ~always~ on wrong side within certain radius of epicenter ( i forget exactly what slice ) because it comes from ~vacuum~ suck
asciilifeform: rather than the 1st pressure front
asciilifeform: trinque: much later item
trinque: sure, biggest one ever built, right?
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform, if it were that close the concrete wouldn't be standing at all, though.
asciilifeform: trinque: biggest ~popped~
mircea_popescu: for the pattern there seen to exist, based on the tech of the time, it must be windblown, naught else.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it happens not in epicenter, but in outskirts of the blast circle
asciilifeform: the backwards pressure is actually stronger, there, somehow, than the 1st wave outward.
asciilifeform: ( why this is possible, i do not now remember, if anyone does -- plox to write in. )
mircea_popescu: sure. but, were it that close, it would not have kept its fucking roof.
asciilifeform: https://archive.li/UmD1i << lulzy, flowers on 60th bday of 'rds'
asciilifeform not expert in subj. but! will leave https://archive.li/8NEUh for the truly lulzcurious, describes lulincident during design , when pure gold (!) bolts were added, in nearly last minute, to homogenize density of the 'implosive' core

2018-5-10 | 2018-5-12