douchebag: mircea_popescu: You doing anything interesting tonight?
mircea_popescu: fancy this : i was walking through the park and i ran into these coupla carny chicks working out their juggling skills. so i asked them if they wanna have desert ; they did so i took them to the local whorehouse restaurant for cheesecake.
douchebag: Cheesecake is pretty good, were they attractive?
mircea_popescu: the bulls were most wtf. the waiters were most wtf. this other black dude sitting there with a horse of a whore was BEYOND WTF. but my chicks dumped their unicycle, circles, pins and whatnot on the floor and had their coffee.
hanbot: phf et al: attempted to press latest vtools to the keccak head. v (mod6's) reports vtools_vpatch_newline not in flow, neither its antecedent vtools_fixes_static_tohex, despite both patches and (verified good) sigs present (they neither show up via flow command). v will press to vtools_vpatch.vpatch, but no further. see http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/oNRhE/?raw=true .
hanbot: not sure if this has something to do with the note in phf's accompanying release post re btcbase presser not working quite right....
mod6: 4) Check the press paths -- there are ~two~ (phf said this was experimental previously)
mod6: 5) Check the origins of the antecedent hashes in 'vtools_fixes_static_tohex.vpatch' to see if we're missing one.
mod6: 6) We're not missing an antecedent vpatch; however, '98ba7212fafa4a61f6d6096f1a2953a67a70fcf185965ed7199a223f6897c9b9f2996d391a3f363282236889413973d0beada0e36d57068549bea672fd110d8d' matches two antecedents
mod6: one will notice that these antecedent origins are from two separate press-paths.
mod6: I'm not sure how to reconsile this. If you have a different v tool that will help you work around this, by all means.
mircea_popescu: mod6 how the heck can both sha fixes and fixes newline have the same hash
mircea_popescu: oh, they don't, they just have the same antecedent. why is this a problem ?
mircea_popescu: 99994 and 99993 correctly press past this split, you're aware.
mod6: 'vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch' and 'vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch' indeed have the same output hash.
mod6: <+mircea_popescu> oh, they don't, they just have the same antecedent. why is this a problem ? << im not sure at this point. could be an edge case im not catching, or could be buried in old rules built into my v.
mod6: this is different than what i'm saying. the two distinct vpatches, 'vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch' and 'vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch', contain the same output, '98ba7212fafa4a61f6d6096f1a2953a67a70fcf185965ed7199a223f6897c9b9f2996d391a3f363282236889413973d0beada0e36d57068549bea672fd110d8d'
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 05:23 mod6: this is different than what i'm saying. the two distinct vpatches, 'vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch' and 'vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc.vpatch', contain the same output, '98ba7212fafa4a61f6d6096f1a2953a67a70fcf185965ed7199a223f6897c9b9f2996d391a3f363282236889413973d0beada0e36d57068549bea672fd110d8d'
mircea_popescu is thoroughly confused through the working of his own ineptitude, will need a moment to extract self.
mod6: phf: i thought last time we encountered a problem like this we dropped out a vpatch, then it was fine.
mod6: but this time, i dunno wtf is going on here. it's a mess.
mircea_popescu: mod6 no, listen, i don't see what the problem you see is. so a number of different patches, which are themselves distinct, nevertheless depend on the same version of a file (here, xaloc). this isn't, nor can be a problem ; and was not a prtoblem before, either.
mod6: oh, im specifically talking about the patch set from your latest post.
phf: i can only say that i think that btcbase presser is doing the same thing, with the "5 steps down keccak and 2 steps down sha", but the grapher doesn't. i think grapher uses more Graph Theory, but i neither remember what the difference is, nor can i debug it now (was about to go to sleep myself)
mircea_popescu: phf it's incomprehensible to me as the manifest.txt varies wildly.
mircea_popescu: anyway, it's not an emergency, sleep tight also we see tomorro
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 04:25 hanbot: phf et al: attempted to press latest vtools to the keccak head. v (mod6's) reports vtools_vpatch_newline not in flow, neither its antecedent vtools_fixes_static_tohex, despite both patches and (verified good) sigs present (they neither show up via flow command). v will press to vtools_vpatch.vpatch, but no further. see http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/oNRhE/?raw=true .
shinohai: Will be happy to serve as extra set of eyes if you want to dig further mod6
asciilifeform: ( it does this for ben_vulpes's most recent key also. i still do not know why. )
phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-09#1794530 << you can see two lines going into vtools_fixes_static_tohex, one from vdiff_fixes_newline_gcc and another from vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc. they are both from 98BA and either should satisfy the requirement. the other two lines in are from vtools_vpatch only for 7EBF and 02A0.
a111: Logged on 2018-04-09 06:34 mircea_popescu: that's the fucking problem! the vtools_fixes_static_tohex uses xalloc.h 98BA when it should instead use its own line (earlier) version of C89B.
mircea_popescu: a right. hanbot do me a favour : download ~only~ those patches which are in the leftmost trunk seen on phf's viewer (so exclude vtools_vdiff_sha, and its dependents) and try to flow again ?
mircea_popescu: mod6 i suspect we ran into a novel situation : if there's ambiguous file usage in multi-head bundles, v panics.
mircea_popescu: (which is not even wrong, as the serial application of patches from different branches can result in a messed up codebase ; but it could be more verbose about what happened)
mod6: alf already instructed me a number of months ago to be more verbose about failures. I didn't get that done as much on the last release as I was trying to limit the scope to the last change for the press-paths.
mod6: So indeed, better failure messages are needed. And if we're going to allow this type of strange project structures, that'll have to get built into the rules.
mircea_popescu: it's not directly clear just ~how~ it could be more verbose here, seeing how it doesn't magically know all the "meanings" we associate to the patches themselves.
mod6: mircea_popescu: solid plan. i can add something like that perhaps when alternate paths are detected.
mircea_popescu: which is a useful warning, because in principle if $1 and $2 could both delivered wanted $file, but the author intended for $1 to be used, $2 might produce different $otherfile than author needed, and then you can't press because your hashes no longer match downstream"
phf: fwiw there's no ambiguity in the patchset, the dependency graph _is constrained_. but you can't make that constraint rule based, you can e.g. discover that constraint by walking the graph while keeping the track of the checksums of the press (i suspect there's a smarter graph theoretical way of doing it, but a "press walk" is the easiest).
phf: obviously that works because btcbase produces the correct dependency graph
mircea_popescu: yeah. so on one hand indeed the problem was as suspected ; but on the other hand phf is correct and yes the graph IS constrained.
mircea_popescu: phf i guess next on your plate is make a prototype proper grapher for all time ? then mod6 can put that in v and avoid further such wtfs.
mircea_popescu: the easiest press walk may in principle become very VERY expensive on large enough projects (in terms of the bitcoin blockchain large, 6 digit patches with 1-3 digit files included each it'd be a true unassailable nightmare). but then again it also bakes in some incentive to NOT DO THAT.
phf: i suppose that's one way to release btcbase source: slowly rewrite it all in ada
asciilifeform: ( speaking of entomological horror, today found https://archive.li/Efx3S in the glue trap : one of those chinese shannonized btc-flavoured liquishit items, but this time claiming to be a trilema article ! )
mircea_popescu: but the devil is in the details. consider how this flows : "so mp, do you want a gui ?" "uh ok" "should it have any buttons on it ?" "kinda what a gui is" "every button will have to be specified, as to location, as to..." "just get on with it" "6mb, will that be cash or check on other people's time ?" "motherfucker..."
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there's lots of mfa using my name / stuff. apparently i'm a valuable google adwords item.
mircea_popescu: anyway, this PARTICULAR item is a chinese forum that actually tracks us / includes (not terrible) translations of trilema pieces for commentary etc.
mircea_popescu: (the great win being 注：爱比特.聂意译，翻译的不一定准确，也可能理解的完全相反，欢迎高手指教。~aka attention: my translation is not necessarily accurate, trilema may very well mean the exact opposite. such is the world of experts.)
asciilifeform not currently equipped to distinguish these from the usual shannonolade , sadly
mircea_popescu: in other sads : "can install following OS for you: Centos 6 and 7; Debian, 6, 7 and 8; Ubuntu 14.04 and 16.04; Ubuntu Desktop; Esxi 5.5 and 6.5; Windows 7 Pro and 10 Pro (trial versions); Windows Server 2008, 2012 and 2016; or we can provide your KVM or IPMI access and you can install your own custom OS like Gentoo e,t,c"
mircea_popescu: soo trinque, can i hire you to install your blessed gentoo in there ?
trinque: wont be the vtronic portage just yet, but yeah, I can install an entirely usable gentoo for ya.
douchebag: That's what I told them, but you know how women are
mircea_popescu: the good news for you mod6 being that you don't really have to do anything ; v.pl is fine as it is, for now, and once phf has a prototype walker you can just move on to that and it'll be cheaper. continue work on your ada guy in the meanwhile at your leisure, seems we're converging that way.
mircea_popescu: and in today's funny spanish lesson : pie, in spanish, means foot. this, of course, does not prevent the uppity coffee house i favour from being all international and offering pie de manzana.
a111: Logged on 2018-04-06 20:58 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: it is not even clear to me that eben moglen (note, not rms) gpl experiment , i.e. 'use copyrasty against itself', worked for a short while ( to naked eye it would seem that it did, bsd routines got subsumed into microshit, gnu -- not , but there ~are~ alternative plausible explanations that don't involve 'fear of gpl violation' )
asciilifeform: the ways these typically end : a) (most common) simply evaporates, no record of wtf happened to the case b) violator supposedly kowtows, 'complies' -- which 100% of the time in practice consists of putting up a tarball ~with the lifted orig turd~, none of the 'viral' provisions of gpl are given any attention at all , but hilariously the plaintiff ~eats this~
mircea_popescu: the motivations are transparently unprincipled. i mean -- they published "support" at the bottom, which 100% consists of cheap linkbait by assholes a la "pump.io" and so forth. support my foot.
asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: at one point i wanted to run the client for 1 of these ( i forget which, maybe 'mastodon' ) and barfed : GB of ruby
mircea_popescu: (this is whart you get if you permit chelsea barabas and other knitters into "tech" : inept articles about how "my ass is really really fat and the couch is really really comfortable".)
asciilifeform: these opensores folx seem to exist to make ye olde microshit look compact, bug-free, runnable
asciilifeform: funnily enuff ~nobody alive knows how to actually build a ruby interpreter from src
asciilifeform spoke with several folx who make a living in it, they all 'wtf go download prebuilt vm'
mircea_popescu: it's a means of expression, you udnerstand this ? emo mostly died because it was evidently pointless, to the poor misunderstood darlings themselves, "all this '''poetry''' that does nothing, not even rhyme."
mircea_popescu: so they came up with the emo spew of the next decade : github contributions!
mircea_popescu: it's just as nonsensical, pointless and useless. but it meets much better standards of self-expression as subjectively perceived.
asciilifeform: '... But managing public keys is hard for most users ... The reality is that most people do not want to run their own web servers or social network nodes. They want to engage with the web through friendlier platforms' << sop prikokeism , snoar
a111: Logged on 2016-12-27 18:18 mircea_popescu: oh, hey, I KNEW this was gonna be in there. a) "I recommend using quaternion variables to represent two things: an object's rotation, and/or a rotation which you'd like to apply to some object." ; b) "You cannot represent rotations of greater than 180 degrees with Quaternions, and when doing a Slerp() or MoveTowards() rotation with Quaternions, the rotation always take the shortest path. So if you need to ro
mircea_popescu: imo definitive explanation of why rubylang rots brain and you're better off learning perl before you start doing 5.days.ago.days.days.ago
mimisbrunnr: Logged on 2018-04-09 15:10 mircea_popescu: ben_vulpes : is this a contract you folks want, incidentally ?
asciilifeform: as i understand this even is brainrot from 10y ago; present-day rubyists do not even see the x.y.ago.ago.ago , but 'program' in 'libraries' written by same ( or perhaps even by a generation of 2 of 'programmers in libraries' )
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform not just usian disease anymore. i had some work done recently, very pretty girl, quite competent (sadly, being a good dentist requires the steady hand only a properly developed brain can produce. retards can't ever be sharpshooters, dentists, surgeons etc because dubious genetics -> dubios fenotype -> too ungaitly assymetric to perform)
mircea_popescu: anyway, and she wanted to put me under! and i was naw, go ahead. took some convincing, and by the time she was halfway through she was sweating profusely and had the shakes. "but doesn't it hurt ?!?!"
mircea_popescu: "well... apparently it hurts you ? i've seen women go through gangbangs with less extrapyramidal effects"
asciilifeform: my local drmengele is, believe or not, the opposite : 'you dun need it' -- proceeds to drill without painkiller. asciilifeform -- used it it by nao
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: all of the machines in the rack are being used; i was asking if one of the rockchips can handle this kind of duty.
phf: mircea_popescu: well, sometimes quality does suck, when you do e.g. a wall projection. those 9gb prints are usually done by obsessive people. but main reason is that i'm pulling from slav sources, where 800mb version is slav audio track only. "original audio track" is a bonus on those "archival" prints
mircea_popescu: kinda why i have 0 interest in teh ruworld torrents, nfi who told these folks it's ok to hire some tolomak to do say richard burton. wtf.
ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: i don't think we have a machine that is even free for this purpose; and so don't understand why we'd ship hdds down without a machine to put 'em in, although i could be being thick and not seeing something
asciilifeform: btw i oughta say a word re how rockchiptron reproduces. i wrote a bit of script, ./breed_boot.sh /dev/sd_whatever_cardreader_with_card_in_it -- produces copy of the boot card ; ./breed_root.sh /dev/large_enuff_disk copies the root partition contents onto a new part on said disk
phf: well, i download the 9gb versions, and have a script that keeps only one specific audio track. the whole thing is a semi manual process though, since i have to select the right track by ear, etc.
mircea_popescu: phf what are you using btw ? i'm thinking deluge, apparently has a web interface can just get the girlies set up with.
phf: aria2, i think it has a web interface even, but the whole thing is entirely automatic. cron to hoover up torrents from ~/Downloads, ssh them into a box folder, sleep based script picks it up on other end, feeds it to aria, when finished downloading writes it to an rss and also to a directory that's expose through apache
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform incidentally, here's an idea : think sokoban, but extended so that 1. there's enemies, which can kill you, and 2. you can actually shoot projectiles at them. take advantage of diagonal/straight piercing/exploding and of course destroyable/nondestroyable movable/non movable environment.
a111: Logged on 2018-03-26 07:31 phf: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-03-19#1788278 << i've discovered similar, my 3g phone barely has signal and doesn't last more than a day in san francisco. presumably because the number of 3g supporting towers is significantly lower here
mircea_popescu: anyway, re earlier discussion : i find it fucking hilarious that the webtards are actually trying to rebuild bulletin boards. "great improvement over php, ruby!". douchebags, php only exists because of your shit-headed "web" hallucination!
mircea_popescu: it only exists because a group of idiots that had no business touching computers nevertheless got some, and their only "idea" was "hey... we should try and control how people display data on their own machines"
mircea_popescu: and i include greenspun in the idiots pile. along with the rest of the "luminaries".
douchebag: well, it's always fun pwning that group of idiots
mircea_popescu: the "problem" of "social media" isn't that people lack the place, methods and mechanisms whereby to communicate their interesting, valuable etcetera verbiage.
mircea_popescu: the problem is that people have absolutely nothing to say to anyone.
asciilifeform: '...a re-implementation of the GNU Social codebase, which itself is ... an implementation of the OStatus protocol, originally forking from the GNU FM project and later merging with the StatusNet and FreeSocial projects, from the same people behind Identi.ca, which was later folded into pump.io, which uses the ActivityStreams spec along with protocols like PubSubHubBub, Salmon, WebFinger, and Atom syndication to deliver a federated, o
asciilifeform: pen-source Twitter-like experience for the masses' << ahahahawaat
mircea_popescu: and it's exactly the reason "sex trafficking" is a problem, also. >99% of females have entirely no value whatsoever, as pigs are cheaper to butcher. of those, 14% or so have some resale value as fucktoys, generally in the bitcent to 0.1 btc range.
mircea_popescu: it's not a fucking problem outside of "holy shit i'm old and i can't deal with reality".
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform there's also an endless supply of the "totally not the same thing as this" "platforms", medium, that shitty thing with "i made $0.05 with this post" reddit tip bot extension and so on.
mircea_popescu: and they're all there because a bunch of business school majors truly imagine they can compete for gatekeeping ; and "content will come"
mircea_popescu: what fucking content, hackernoon is pompously "where hackers give a shit" except omitting to discuss how slashdot sold to spammers for exactly the sex traffic value above, and slashdot ACTUALLY WAS a place hackers gave a shiot about, unlike hackernews, say, idle pretense aside.
mircea_popescu: their top stories being... "i grepped reddit for a string", "here is some shannonized nonsense about a topic too large for enric durany to touch", "how a kid from sf started a school in india" and ON AND ON.
mircea_popescu: why exactly is this needed, vice couldn't handle the volume of all the useless crap fat ugly whores spewed out for $5 a title ?
a111: Logged on 2018-03-31 16:58 mircea_popescu: "Four years ago this month, I found out that Jane Pratt the editor that had made me want to be an editor since I was 12 years old had chosen me to be the beauty director of her new xoJane beauty spinoff, xoVain. OK, so I was actually her second choice her first had fallen through but that was OK. I had previously not even pitched to xoJane because I was so intimidated and sure I'd be rejected, so
mircea_popescu: i mean, if i bother to pick it up and mock it it maybe becomes content, on a slow day. but there's one of me and at last count >50mn of the idiots.
mircea_popescu: and no, "anything is content for someone" dun fucking hold. this is the direct equivalent of the "dating site" fallacy, whereby "eveyone has a special someone matching them put on this earth by our infantile protestant notion of god" becomes a "scientific blabla" (ie, http://trilema.com/2015/the-lulz-in-dating/#selection-69.0-89.459 ). bullshit. most people are broken, and the idea that they'll be "harmoniously broken togeth
mircea_popescu: er" is exactly like having two broken cars on your front lawn. gimme the porsche and let me be, wtf.
asciilifeform: cassidy3: this is in fact where mircea_popescu lives. you might have to wait a few hrs for him to wake up, however. meanwhile there is a log, http://btcbase.org/log , and you can read it or even speak 'into' it, he will read later at his leisure.
mircea_popescu: asciilifeform by the way, saw an add somewhere which went like "hello, this is massage therapist. no seriously, not sex whatsoever. this is medical. please don't wink wink nudge nudge."
mircea_popescu: somehow the longer the plaintive wail of the "went to college! independent professional woman!" went, the pornier it sounded.
BingoBoingo: The big brainfuck in this country is that "Thai Massage" is how they refer to the thing without the happy ending
BingoBoingo: Whereas the hooker massages are just massages
mimisbrunnr: Logged on 2018-04-09 15:16 mircea_popescu: the good news for you mod6 being that you don't really have to do anything ; v.pl is fine as it is, for now, and once phf has a prototype walker you can just move on to that and it'll be cheaper. continue work on your ada guy in the meanwhile at your leisure, seems we're converging that way.
mod6: mircea_popescu: yeah, would like to do that one. main reason i stuffed it in a drawer for the time being was that I was getting some really crumby performance with the manual string handling I was doing.
mod6: I've been digging in here for about 15 minutes, and I've found the spot where we eject out those two vpatches. And the reason is that I do a kinda shitty check. Where I just compare that the number of node edges is equal to the number of expected.
mod6: And in the case here, we have 1 more for each vpatch, where the extra one matches one already in the set. If I were to check each one to the other, then I think it'd be better, and avoid this problem. So I'm kinda working on a solution now.
mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-09#1794956 << "One day a student came to Moon and said: "I understand how to make a better garbage collector. We must keep a reference count of the pointers to each cons." Moon patiently told the student the following story: "One day a student came to Moon and said: I understand how to make a better garbage collector..."
mod6: Well, I've implemented a better check there in the 'ante_check' subroutine. And I was gonna mess with it a bit more, but when I went to press the shorter of the two paths (visible at http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=vtools ), I ran into a press problem.
mod6: Then I went ahead and tried to manually patch these files together, first 'vtools_genesis.vpatch', then 'vtools_vdiff_sha.vpatch', then 'vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc', and this is what I'm seeing:
mod6: Then I went ahead and tried to manually patch these files together, first 'vtools_genesis.vpatch', then 'vtools_vdiff_sha.vpatch', then 'vdiff_sha_fixes_newline_gcc', and this is what I'm seeing: