Mocky: I did but I had to fix a number of things like a faulty parse of the "exploration marker" message and unable to find table & lbn in inventory. Also sometimes it seemed to try to build the wrong claim, so I improved that and taught it to autoloot lbn from the ground
Mocky: ahh, i saw those when looking for books earlier today but didn't make the connection
Mocky: this game is different to what I expected, in a good way. I was afraid the 'bitcoin economy' was going to be a gambling thing or a bullshit communist 'share the wealth' thing like I've seen in other games
diana_coman: no, no, they do share their "wealth" too; it just has those...""
Mocky: I saw one free to play game where everyone logged in gets a % share of optional items purchased. jesus, if i wanted a welfare state of poor beggars funded by 1%'ers I can just walk out my front door
diana_coman: heh, where in the world is your front door Mocky ?
diana_coman: at any rate, follow Fox behind the house and trade so I give you a tool
danielpbarron: not sure there is any os left out there you can follow the wiki guide "to a T" on
mircea_popescu: danielpbarron, Manjaro thing apparently is arch flavour.
diana_coman: fwiw I've recently re-compiled eulora client on a fresh gentoo and it was pretty much straightforward (gcc 4.9 though, not 6. or other wonders)
diana_coman: if anything needs added, perhaps add in red on the wiki "gcc 4.9 required"
diana_coman: oh, and it works even without nvidia stuff; probably not as high fps as with it but not really problematic at all
Mocky: diana_coman, I got stuck again. Not the crater this time, fell off the edge of the world. Can you help me out, pretty please?
danielpbarron: Mocky, if you feel up to it, there is a place in the client code that defines movement behavior, and you can change the 'y' value from '0' to something like '100' to make your character jump high in the sky, and hopefully out of whatever pit you are in
diana_coman: you might need to fix foxybot on the logging part too since it used to just log as "output" the difference between what it had in inv of that sort before and after; trouble is that this was made at a time when stuff was mixed automatically and unavoidably so it doesn't take into consideration quality/doesn't look for more than one pile; moreover iirc the inv msg processing needs a small fix too
Mocky: mircea_popescu: so you'll know, I have not forgotten http://logs.bvulpes.com/eulora?d=2018-5-3#348177 ; I have a series of 4 posts in mind to describe my work on foxybot. 2 are complete the third is in progress. Setup of the blog itself is also underway and I expect to publish this week.
mimisbrunnr: Logged on 2018-05-03 17:55 mircea_popescu: tell you what, i'll buy you shared hosting on pizarro's server for the rest of the year, you get a blog up there and publish the foregoing. how about that ?
mircea_popescu: Mocky, not more than 2 posts in mind at any time plox.
mircea_popescu: diana_coman, did you want tuber milk btw ? or i don't recall what we were doing with it.
diana_coman: mircea_popescu, can't quite recall; possibly it was part of cheese but iirc I still have a load of cheese
mircea_popescu: Mocky, it's complicated-er than it seems. the top reports the total value, but because of overcraft one can a) always get in the top if they are doing expensive enough things and b) not necessarily profit by it.
mircea_popescu: anyway,80% or so return on tm isn't the end of the world, iirc that was expensive af.
Mocky: I think I was seeing the same thing on a small rr claim where 244 worth of cft and 187 tool wear got me 361 worth of rr for a 16% loss. or would have been had not diana_coman bought at a premium to give me 8% profit
mircea_popescu: Mocky, most things sell at premiums, for this reason. the game is a) getting the premiums right and b) managing to wring a few % out of the tower.
diana_coman: Mocky, that's part of the trouble with "what is this worth?" : the quality-adjusted base value is really just that, a baseline, the minimum value as it were since s.mg via npc will pay that for it
mircea_popescu: imo a very close approximation of actual reality. certainly the closest one of these "virtual economies" in games ever got.
mircea_popescu: alright, so what humongous task are you ready for next ?
Mocky: I was thinking post number 4, but that's not exactly humongous
mircea_popescu: ok, the situation here is : we're not the happiest ever with the quality of legacy code ; and about to move to a new client-server paradigm, detailed in www.dianacoman.com/2018/04/17/rfc-euloras-communication-protocol-eucomms/
mircea_popescu: if you attempt to hack the client into shape so as to use the new thing, even if unsuccessful, you will be in a prime position to be an actual client releaser once that rolls around.
Mocky: I'm down to attempt that level of client change. Just be aware that the only thing I know about c++ is that it looks like java but with more stupid shit. I don't know where the landmines are and I don't have the reference to say if I hacked it into better or worse shape
lobbes: Mocky, does your blog have an RSS feed? I'll add it to the blog-roll in here if so
Mocky: lobbes, I'll let you know once I turn that on
diana_coman: ahahah, those posts are great to read, Mocky
diana_coman: you have a comment in there waiting moderation too
diana_coman: re "only when it's needed" stuff at equip: the reason for that (looong time ago,not really applicable anymore) was that each action took a weird dance of do-wait-check-wait-done and so one really did not want to ask to waste all that time if not needed
Mocky: diana_coman, thanks, they were fun to write
mimisbrunnr: Logged on 2018-05-15 13:19 diana_coman: you might need to fix foxybot on the logging part too since it used to just log as "output" the difference between what it had in inv of that sort before and after; trouble is that this was made at a time when stuff was mixed automatically and unavoidably so it doesn't take into consideration quality/doesn't look for more than one pile; moreover iirc the inv msg processing needs a small fix too
diana_coman: Mocky, at the time when I made foxybot claims came exactly and precisely where your char was; nowadays they seem to be a bit fuzzier so you might want to weigh this if you look into making/updating maps (i.e. whether bot should consider claim location as it does iirc or char's location)
Mocky: also diana_coman, i have 1 or 2 more posts that will be coming out that cover foxybot changes I made before you pointed me to your foxybot blog posts, so if they show ignorance of something you've discussed, pls don't think I ignored your suggestion
mircea_popescu: "I used it for days but there was a small problem that bugged me more than a small problem should." <<->> "Foxybot bending over to pick something up 'seductively' at the moment I happen to look at the screen. Coincidence?"
diana_coman: "grab closest" was a simple heuristic for "most likely to be mine as opposed to someone else's who happens to explore around me" - at some point there was this issue when people explored close to one another (because messages from server for new claims don't identify explicitly who the owner is)
lobbesbot: --- end of auction list, 0 total bids ---
diana_coman: my shop says basics 195%; I would sell craftables at 125% but certainly not resources, esp not q>10, esp not non-basics etc
diana_coman: mircea_popescu, and yes, I think your shop is rather outdated but I don't recall last time you updated it or what
mircea_popescu: says 2016. the stuff in auction report is from 2017 -- though wasn't this before cft was available ?
diana_coman: anyways, what can I say, that's what I can sell wpl atm for; if nobody takes it, fine with me, I'll make it into stuff and sell that at lower % because atm this is how it is, harvestables are more difficult to get high q now
mircea_popescu: diana_coman, turns out i have everything needed to make cs, should i do that then ?
diana_coman: I dunno about the others but from where I'm standing I'd say yes, atm that's the main bottleneck (not least because we're living now on old bps but presumably stocks will finish at some point)
diana_coman: mircea_popescu, what markup would you want for them?
Mocky: ok so I'm hitting ordinary claims bare handed at a rate of about 2 per thousand now. it seems +ev to build them but less profitable than continuing on with tiny claims. Unless there's demand for tubers, rr or rf at quality 1 at 2x base price
mircea_popescu: i'd take nt / rf actually. why not pile a bunch an' make an auction ?
Mocky: i don't have the coppers to buy the bundles, and if i make myself with 0 tinkering I don't expect good results
mircea_popescu: it's not that "oh, eulora is a bitcoin game that isn't a flimsy wrapper atop a jukebox". it's that eulora ~actually does decentralization~. not in the certification-seeking way, either, but as a fundamental, conceptual thing, resulting in incomprehensible stuff like "hey, recipes -- vary by reader. like fucking ancient texts. probolem ?"
mimisbrunnr: Logged on 2018-04-29 19:04 diana_coman: Mocky, well done; Foxy can make bundles with 69 to 94 bits of nothing so if you gather some serious quantities of bits of nothing bring them to me and I'll pack you some serious bundles; I'll also buy low quality rickety reeds
diana_coman: Mocky, aha; from the other side it can be difficult to say which part/where you don't get it unless you ..say something
diana_coman: in other news, I just had Fox make some 15 sm ord bundles but it's a pain
diana_coman: basically I'd sell ord bundles I suppose if only I could do them by bot pretty much
diana_coman: (they ended up ~900q without much trouble really)
diana_coman: ofc that didn't even help foxy much as she still got q3 out of the ord...
Mocky: diana_coman, at the time I thought I understood!
diana_coman: takes a bit of time to become eulora-suspicious enough
diana_coman: btw, do you get any *small* claim by hand Mocky ? or just tiny and ords?
danielpbarron: i didn't see any ord ingredients. a few slag recipies and some basics
mircea_popescu: in other remarkable news : the oiriginal craft time delay was intended to balance economic considerations not yet much expressed in game. it has the misfortune that it stepped on my toe earlier, and so it's going the fuck away. starting wed all crafts will complete instantly ; the time system will be re-introduced later, once a) we finally get the fucking npcs and other items needed so player can increase productivity as origi
mircea_popescu: nally designed and b) decouple crafting from net connection, so it can be simple queue.
diana_coman: in bv terms it would be indeed 150% so basically 150% is absolute minimum for which fox could sell *any* harvestables really (since at anything lower than that she's better off just crafting it and getting same in actual bv
diana_coman: of course, it might be that fox is simply too good a crafter to actually sell harvestables directly and that's that
diana_coman: (i.e. others might be able to sell harvestables at a lower markup and still find it best option for them)
diana_coman: mircea_popescu, danielpbarron ^ ; adding to that, it turns out time might be the killer but quite in the sense of making it even iffier to sell harvestables - atm fox is crafting faster than she mines so there clearly is no surplus
diana_coman: I guess the only hope there comes from a set of determined noob miners to flood the market with cheaper harvestables
diana_coman: in this vein, Foxy'll have to offer bundles I suppose so I'll look into that next
diana_coman: uhm, one of my noobs picked up a table crafted by some christian guy
diana_coman: trying again to build a remark with a 200q bundle so not even something crazy: client reports...41 days needed
Mocky: diana_coman, just got a small claim bare handed
diana_coman: I'm pondering the apparent fact that bps kind of lost their crown
diana_coman: i.e. no more x items per bp then bp is ...qabv only?
diana_coman: exploring looks all of a sudden a way more... peaceful adventure
diana_coman: and I think it might be ...interesting to actually get cs now mircea_popescu ; if foxy's results are anything to go by, high skill seems to end up in higher q indeed but mainly numina, not crafted item
lobbesbot: --- end of auction list, 4.725mn total bids ---
Mocky: mircea_popescu, I have a lead on a possible artist, dude named travis. Supposedly does graphic novels, likes video games and has experience doing contract art work. He works with my son, I haven't met him. If he's interested should I have him drop by #eulora?
Mocky: I tried out the 4072q lbn. I used one to make a cdg bundle q4072. it took 10x the time to build the claim as a q11 bundle but resulted in 21 q1 cdg: same as with a q11 lbn. I did it 4 times, identical result. But also approx 40x more building xp granted.